rionaleonhart | Flinging The Lives Of Your Companions Around For Fun And Profit.

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Flinging The Lives Of Your Companions Around For Fun And Profit.

So. 'The Girl in the Fireplace'. Definitely not one of my favourite episodes, mostly because the ending infuriated me.

I was kind of hoping that someone would mention Captain Jack, seeing as they were in his home century, but no. Alas.

"It's a temporal hyperlink!"
"What's that?"
"No idea. Just made it up. I didn't want to say 'magic door'."
Hee!

...so, er, did the Doctor and Madame de Pompadour dance?

"Why can't we use the TARDIS?"
"We're part of events now! The TARDIS won't help us!"
THAT IS THE LAZIEST REASONING THAT I HAVE EVER SEEN. SOMETHING THAT MAKES SOME DEGREE OF SENSE PLEASE.

I'm glad Madame de Pompadour didn't become a companion. I mean, I know, very sad and all that, but, er, I found her rather irritating.

You know, it's kind of interesting that there was a huge suspenseful tragic love story on Madame de Pompadour's side, lasting for most of her life, but from the Doctor's point of view he knew her for less than a day.

I still love Mickey. Awww. ("You're not keeping the horse." "I let you keep Mickey!" Hee!)

And now for the main focus of this post: that 'OH I WILL GO OFF TO SAVE MY NEW LOVE WITH NO WAY OF RETURNING AND LEAVE MY COMPANIONS BEHIND' bit. Oh yes. A lot of people seem to have been expressing their anger about this and saying 'HE WOULDN'T LEAVE ROSE THERE HE IS IN LOVE WITH HER'. I have to say that my view is 'HE WOULDN'T LEAVE ROSE AND MICKEY THERE HE IS A HALFWAY DECENT BEING'. Love has nothing to do with it.

Okay, Doctor, I am so not happy with you right now. Seriously, you didn't know about the Deus Ex Fireplace. How, exactly, did you think you were going to get back to that spaceship? What if you didn't manage to survive another three thousand years? Even if you did, how would you have got up there? Did you think about any of these things?

As far as I can tell, you just abandoned Mickey and Rose on a fifty-first-century derelict spaceship. In jumping through that time window, you destroyed all the other exits into a remotely habitable world. Neither of them could fly the TARDIS. You knew this.

From the finale of the previous series, it seems that you are capable of operating the TARDIS remotely via sonic screwdriver. You could have sent Rose and Mickey back to Earth, so that they, y'know, wouldn't starve to death on an abandoned spaceship. If you were being really sensible, you could have sent them back to a year or so after the point you were heading to, met them and carried on with your time-travelling life. You did neither of these things.

Okay, perhaps you can't operate the TARDIS remotely - perhaps you could only activate the pre-programmed emergency protocol, which you have now disabled because you thought 'oh, well, I am sure that I will never need this program for sending Rose back to her own timeline again'. This would be a stupid thing to do, but let's say you did it.

You still don't abandon your companions. That is just Not On. Starving to death on an empty spaceship doesn't sound like fun to me. You should at the very least have sent them through one of the working Time Windows before you destroyed them all. Maybe they wouldn't be able to get back to their regular lives, but they'd have more of a life in eighteenth-century France than on that ship. Or you could have figured out a way of bringing them through the Time Window with you. Maybe you could have all managed to fit on the horse, if you sat very close. You could have done something, not just left them there, you git.

You know, I just think you get some sadistic pleasure out of dumping your companions on abandoned space stations. Jack, Rose, Mickey - do you just have something against all of my favourite characters?

Seriously. RAGE. The fact that they are not actually stuck there forever in no way makes him any less stupid.

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I found my way here from

time_and_chips. And I have to say...I TOTALLY agree with you. The episode angered/upset me on so many levels. Mainly upset, because I was crying my eyes out when he left Rose on the ship and went back to France (permanently, or so he thought).

I'm glad Madame de Pompadour didn't become a companion. I mean, I know, very sad and all that, but, er, I found her rather irritating.

I couldn't stand her. Yes I know I'm a pathetic Ten/Rose fangirl but...why, solely from her knowledge of what he goes through mentally, does he automatically fall madly in love - so madly that he'd leave behind the woman he's obviously been in love with the entire time, and knowing that he can never be a time traveller AND knowing that she is trapped forever on that ship, with no way of piloting the TARDIS?

There were so many inconsistencies in that episode. He only meets her on a few occasions, that is hardly enough to fall in love with her, even if she knows how he feels about everything. He's already in love with Rose, surely, that has been established so many times. It is just so out of character that he'd leave Rose behind like that.

Unless - and I pray that I'm right here - he knew all along about the fireplace and knew that he could get back to Rose. And perhaps, if that's true, he knew that by going back through the fireplace (even after telling Reinette to pack a bag) he'd go back to Rose and be in a different time to her. You know, like when the Ninth Doctor tells Rose to go into the TARDIS and wait for him in 'Parting of the Ways' and she thinks he's coming with her and he doesn't, for her own good.

That's probably just my pathetic speculation there. But I will say one thing: not a fan of Stephen Moffatt right now...

Jack was from the 52nd century. But I still wish he'd been pointed out, yeah. D:

I think what they meant with the whole part of events thing is that they'd be crossing their timeline- because the ship and France were connected and were sortof at the same time, if they went into the TARDIS to stop the robots there'd be two versions of them in the same place (sortof) and then we have reapers, yay.

But GOD, he shouldn't have left Mickey and Rose! He just.. left them for someone he hardly knew for an hour! The Doctor sacrifices himself, not others. D:

No, Jack was from the 51st century. And interesting that it was also Moffat who wrote that as Jack's origins. I was so sure, when the Doctor said that was where they were, that Rose would say something about Jack. :(

Anyway. Couldn't agree more with your comments. I loved Moffat's episodes last year. This year he's just committed character assassination.

Someone said on the

time_and_chips thread that he also abandoned Sarah-Jane, but he didn't leave her somewhere she'd die, did he? He took her back to Earth, to her own country and her own time.

Nope, this episode so did not do it for me. Sloppy writing and character assassination. :(

Ah, I miss Jack :(

Good points. It was very very very out of character I felt. And it has been a COMPLETE U-turn. Only time will tell, (if we're lucky).

I think they must have had some sort of off-screen way to work the TARDIS enough to get back to earth. Because he asked her "How long did you wait?" and she was like "Five and a half hours!" and he was like "Great, good, always wait that long!", so that implies they could have done something else other than, like, commit ritual suicide.

Still. His conduct a tad odd, I think. But I'm trying desperately to explain it all away in my head so it makes some sort of sense.

Okay, now you've given me the mental image of him turning up five hours and thirty-five minutes later, just in time to see Rose and Mickey fling themselves out of an airlock. And the image made me giggle. Because I am clearly a horrible person.

I seriously can't think of any way in which leaving them behind like that does not make him an irresponsible git. Not happy with you, Doctor. Not happy at all.

If you're a horrible person, so am I. That's the funniest thing I've read today.

And I was seriously annoyed at the Doctor. I totally agree with the above comment --just WHO, let alone the DOCTOR, of all people, just leaves two naive little Terrans to cope with a cannibal spaceship?

If that had been Ace, or Peri, or even Mel, the Doctor would have been SO dead -in Ace's case, prolly literally as well as figuratively -but Rose just takes it in the chest and thinks nothing of it. Very sloppy writing. Was Moffat under the influence or something?

And now the trailers for Season Three are apparently showing him kissing Martha. RTD and Moffat must die. Wanna help lol? You bring the sonic screwdriver and the grappling hook.

I'm bringing the baseball bat and Nitro-9.

I don't get why he didn't send Mickey and Rose away before he did the mad dash with the horse through the mirror. He did it in Parting of the Ways!

Also, I was hoping the horse would've become a new companion :(.

I totally, completely, absolutely, utterly, all encompassingly (/Mitch Hedberg) agree with you!

I have to say that my view is 'HE WOULDN'T LEAVE ROSE AND MICKEY THERE HE IS A HALFWAY DECENT BEING'. Love has nothing to do with it.

THANK YOU. Yes. Love has nothing to do with it. It was a crap ass thing to do to a friend/companion. It was not clever or impressive. I miss the very clever, impressive, smart Doctor we saw in Nine.

I love DT, he is ~~so pretty~~ fun to watch and his version of the Doctor is great by me, BUT... Ten is being written in such a way that he comes across as... stupid? selfish? not at all clever or impressive?

Argh. I'm just going to pretend that this episode didn't happen.

Shoving my way in to your comment, hope it's okay.

Ten is being written in such a way that he comes across as... stupid? selfish? not at all clever or impressive?

To me, he's bordering on being written wholely unlikeable. And I never thought that would be possible for me. I understand Ten being written differently in order to show a subtle difference between the two, but you shouldn't change the parts that helped to build the character in the first place, and what helped to draw Rose to him as well.

I completely agree.

And I feel the same is being done to Rose to a point as well.

I thought I was done, but I have more.

Madame de Pompadour didn't annoy me, I even kinda liked her*, but the I've Been In Love With Him All My Life thing felt so forced. When she first saw the Doctor, how old was she? Like... Seven? Boy, thems some hormones when you're seven, I tell ya! *facetardis*

They should have left out the love thing all together, in my opinion. And if she did make further romantic advances, the Doctor should have seemed shocked, said no, SOMETHING.

ARGH!!!

*because she was smart and clever and curious like Rose used to be/should still be written -- that's kinda what made her special to begin with, remember, RTD???

Hey, dropped by from

time_and_chips. Thought I should mention that I pretty much agree with everything you said in the last six paragraphs. WHAT AN IDIOT.

Um, plotholes, much?
*seethes a little bit*

Came here from a link in who_daily, and I'm right on board with you. I'm still relatively new to the series, but I coudln't believe how angry I was during most of this episode. Him leaving them behind was just the icing on the cake.

I have to say that my view is 'HE WOULDN'T LEAVE ROSE AND MICKEY THERE HE IS A HALFWAY DECENT BEING'. Love has nothing to do with it.

Great point. I wrote a huge rant about the episode in my journal, in that I wasn't upset about this episode from any kind of a shipping angle. I was upset from a fan of good characterization and purposeful storytelling angle. It was sloppy writing, with people (namely The Doctor) acting out of character. It didn't make senese, especially after his quick "No, not you." from the last episode.

The Madame bothered me too. I felt no connection to her, I'm not sure why we were supposed to care about her. And as a result, his willingness to give up everything to save her and spend the rest of his time there with her made no sense. It wasn't romantic for me, it was just NOT like The Doctor at all.

In my anger, I didn't even mention a few of the things I liked in the episode, namely one-liners like the horse/Mickey one you quoted. That was fabulous.

In my anger, I didn't even mention a few of the things I liked in the episode, namely one-liners like the horse/Mickey one you quoted. That was fabulous.

I'm guilty of the same thing. All bitch, no praise.

It was a very pretty episode. The one liners were very funny. I could even go for the story -- MINUS the companion abandonment and insta-love -- plot-holy as it was.

God, THANK YOU.

I'm practically twitching over here hours later. Jumping through the Time Window was just about the laziest bit of storytelling I've ever seen on this show, and that includes all previous incarnations. Not to mention, the pastedeonyay, but I digress.

There isn't anything to add to your ranting; you've covered all the bases. This was just so... ARGH.

...Actually, I couldn't stop laughing. I'm pretty sure I was laughing at some of the sheer BAD of some of it (like when Madame de Pompadour kissed the Doctor? FELL OUT OF MY CHAIR LAUGHING, DAMNIT), but still.

Ditto about Jack. :(

You know, it's kind of interesting that there was a huge suspenseful tragic love story on Madame de Pompadour's side, lasting for most of her life, but from the Doctor's point of view he knew her for less than a day.
I found his confusion/nonchalance and her obsession with him HIGHLY amusing. I think I'm probably a bad person for this.

Mickey was LOVE.

And I must say, Rose wins the prize for best-delivered line this ep. The way she said it was just perfect.
Rose: *rolls eyes* Oh, you're NOT keeping the horse!
Doctor: I let you keep Mickey!
Me: *dead from laughter*

I loved the horse. It was absolute win. Plus when the Doctor was like "We don't have a truck!" I instantly responded with, "But you have a horse! =D"

In the Doctor's defence, he tends to be very idealistic in that he will do whatever it takes to put things to rights, as they should be, particularly if he feels history is at stake here. I get the impression that he gets very caught up in whatever he's doing and doesn't think about the consequences, particularly consequences to himself - and as Rose and Mickey were an extension of consequences to himself, not consequences to the event that needed fixing, he might not even have realized that he was going to be stranding them. ...Other than that, I do agree with you. ^^;

So really, when it was revealed that he was stuck, I was more, "Well, you're just a great big idiot, aren't you?" than "The Doctor wouldn't do that!" I DID expect him to then go, "OH SHIT, ROSE! (and Mickey! yeah not really)" and smack his forehead, and I was annoyed when that didn't happen.

In the Doctor's defence, he tends to be very idealistic in that he will do whatever it takes to put things to rights, as they should be, particularly if he feels history is at stake here. I get the impression that he gets very caught up in whatever he's doing and doesn't think about the consequences

This got me to thinking (dangerous, that). Was Nine that way? The first thing that sprang to mind was World War Three, locked away in that room. The Doctor knew that there was always a way out, but he was trying to find another option. That to me is someone who obviously was thinking about the consequences of his actions (and non-actions). Second thing to come to mind is sending Rose away in PotW of course, but I was trying to remember earlier events (and ones that weren't quite so strikingly life or death).

So can anyone else think of a time that Nine endangered Rose so foolishly?

I DID expect him to then go, "OH SHIT, ROSE! (and Mickey! yeah not really)" and smack his forehead, and I was annoyed when that didn't happen.

Yeah. He was more concerned for himself, if you ask me. And maybe Rose and Mickey would have been fine, but the subtext did not indicate such.

I don't know; Nine's series did begin to have an emphasis on consequences towards the end (in particular the consequences of the Doctor's interference in 'The Long Game' coming back to haunt him in 'Bad Wolf'). The difference is that, let's be honest, that would have been a very difficult thing to predict. You just don't think 'okay, we've destroyed the broadcasting station, what if a century from now everyone's watching evil reality shows?' The consequences of jumping through that time window were staring him in the face. He knew that it would break the link - he said so, and if he had time to worry about the consequences of that for himself and decide to value Reinette above them, you'd think that he would have considered what would happen to his companions.

The problem with the "impressions" I get is that I have no idea where I get them from. They're just gut feeling. e_e So let's see if I actually had any idea what I was talking about.

I think what I said about the consequences thing I meant primarily for the Tenth Doctor. I can't vouch for how much personality usually changes between the Doctors prior to Nine, but I know there is some, at least, and this might be something that changed between Nine and Ten. On the other hand, remember 'Dalek'? Nine chose to shut the door without guarenteeing that Rose would escape. That wasn't about not knowing the consequences, but it was about putting history/current situation over himself/Companions. Granted, it was an entire country/world at stake then as opposed to a single woman, but the Doctor also probably knows better than we do how drastic the results of messing with the history of even one person could be on everything that ever happens following (ie: how much would Reinette's premature death screw the rest of history?).

And I don't know, it was something about the way he said that he knew he wouldn't be able to get back that gave me the impression that he KNEW, but he hadn't really THOUGHT about it. It was just kind of a knowledge in the back of his mind, because he really was in a hurry and sort of flustered in getting organized to go through the time window. Going back to what I said earlier, I do think Ten is less... level-headed? less concerned, perhaps? more nonchalant - about, well, everything than Nine was. Nine was more emotional; Ten seems more... eh, shallow - but on purpose, I think. I liked his bout of emotion in 'School Reunion' when he was explaining to Rose why it's so difficult for him to have Companions and why he'd never mentioned Sarah Jane before ("Humans decay, and I don't, Rose - you don't have any idea how hard it is to watch that happening," or something along those lines). I felt it showed that that was more his real feelings and the flightiness was sort of a cover - whereas Nine wore it all out on his sleeve.

But maybe that's just me looking for REPRESSED ANGST OMG.

Hahaha I contradicted myself in that second big (third actual) paragraph! XP What I meant was that he is sorta flighty to cover AND not have to deal with angsty inner feelings - it's a facade that's also a way of thinking, as it's as much a barrier from himself as from others. Thus, he does things like know consequences and not THINK about them, because he's flighty (need new adj wtf) like that. But not really on the occasion that he looks inside himseeeelf! AND WOW LOOK AT ME GO! YAY OVER-ANALYSIS. I bet you guys are gonna totally tear me to shreds now. XD

WAIT I'M NOT TOTALLY CRAZY CUZ WHEN REINETTE READ HIS MIND SHE'S ALL "OMG YOU'RE SO LONELY OH NOES!" SEE I'M RIGHT IT'S CANON REPRESSED ANGST YO.

hahahaha ow my head.

Hiya.

While this isn't about Doctor Who, I do agree.

But, anyway, I'm a friend of

thegreatesthits and I happened to think that scrubs + silent hill was only the most brilliantly silly idea ever, so she advised me over here.

of course, then I saw your excellent scrubs fic and my mind exploded a little from said excellence so I figured I should friend you - if I may be so bold.

so hello,
em

Hi!

Okay, you're a friend of

thegreatesthits, you like the idea of Scrubs/Silent Hill (which would be the best worst thing ever - I would love to see Cox in the town and JD trying to get him back. Somebody has to write it), you have a JD-and-Cox icon, you flatter me about my fanfiction (thank you!) - I think that I like you already.

THERE'S SO MUCH LOVE IN THIS ROOM!

I love the little series-of-JD/Cox-icons thing we've got going on here. Have I ruined it by using the same one twice? I was sorely tempted to reshuffle my icons and fill all six slots with JD/Cox just so I'd be able to extend the chain, and then it occurred to me that that would be crazy.

But also really hot.

NEVER FEAR! Pool-table!nuzzle-age shall save us!

Oh, you know you want to.

Hmmm. Well, Madame de Pompadour - in spite of the *ridiculous* name - was, I felt, rather a good character, although...am I the only person who had the biggest "what the hell" moment ever when she snogged the Doctor? Seriously! You've met the guy twice and the first time you were seven...that is one screwed up childhood.

But you're right. I saw Doctor Who Confidential before the episode and they talked about how tragic it was that they were in love but it was doomed from the start...they...met three times...in what, for the Doctor, is your average day's work. I can understand the feeling of something that *might* be love in that kind of timeframe, but...just...what the hell? You don't give up your companions for that! They've been with you for...a long time (at least, Rose has) and she's an attractive, intelligent - but a) only one and b) *taken* woman...

(If he's that hung up on her why can't he nip the TARDIS into 17th century France for a few hours?)

Well, Madame de Pompadour - in spite of the *ridiculous* name

Uhm, well, it was her real name, as she actually existed.

www.madamedepompadour.com

I didn't mind her name, but maybe having a first and middle French name myself makes me bias. :)

Oh, I'm not denying that. And I have no problem with French names - some of them are very nice =) It's just that, real person or not, that name made me giggle like a maniac.

We wouldn't have somebody to call Poopy if we hadn't been introduced to Pompadour. :D

Too true! =D

...wait, what?

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Flinging The Lives Of Your Companions Around For Fun And Profit.

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